ruszczyk: listen to marketers & let them lead | capstone conversations

despite industry progress, ruszczyk says many firms still struggle to stand out in a crowded market. “everyone says, ‘our people are great,’ but that’s just noise,” she says. “what clients care about is: what can you do for me?”

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she encourages firms to define and embrace what truly sets them apart, while also having the courage to identify which clients aren’t a good fit.

“firms are often afraid to let go of that 10 percent of clients that aren’t aligned,” she says. “but when you do, you make room for the ones who really value your services. and that time investment pays off exponentially.”

reflecting on her own career, ruszczyk emphasizes how the profession has become more open to non-accounting voices in leadership, though she urges marketers not to wait for an invitation.

“grab your seat at the table,” she says. “don’t wait for a partner to ask. show them what firms like theirs are doing, and how other marketing leaders are helping drive results.”

ruszczyk cites examples of former marketers who now serve as managing partners, ceos, and c-suite leaders, including beachfleischman’s eric majchrzak. “it’s about diversity of thought, background, and experience,” she says.

ruszczyk’s core message for marketers: be bold and know your value.

“find your internal advocates. and if your firm doesn’t appreciate you, find one that does,” she says. “life is short. there are firms out there who will give you the respect and support you need to thrive.”

she also stresses the importance of ongoing learning, especially from outside the accounting profession. “marketers spend so much time teaching others. we have to refill the well, too.”

asked what advice she’d give managing partners, ruszczyk didn’t hesitate: “listen to your marketers. respect them as the strategists they are.”

she also urges firms to embrace niche markets. “i work with a firm that only serves dental practices,” she says. “they know that space inside and out, which makes their service—and our marketing—infinitely more effective.”

ruszczyk shares her own entrepreneurial story of launching bbr companies with zero clients and no safety net. what sustained her? genuine connections—and people willing to help.

“one person sent 15 emails introducing me to potential clients,” she recalls. “that gave me my first real momentum. i try to pay that forward every chance i get.”

7 top takeaways:

1. differentiation is essential. firms must move beyond vague claims and articulate clear value to their ideal clients.
2. not all clients are worth keeping. letting go of bad-fit clients opens capacity for higher-value relationships.
3. marketers need a seat at the strategy table. strategic growth decisions benefit from marketing insight and an external perspective.
4. confidence matters. if you don’t feel it yet, invest in learning and mentorship to get there.
5. niche = growth. firms that focus narrowly on specific industries or services tend to achieve better results and execute marketing more easily.
6. firm culture matters. respect for marketing professionals directly impacts retention and innovation.
7. it’s ok to move on. if a firm doesn’t value your contribution, find one that does.

more about bonnie buol ruszczyk
bonnie buol ruszczyk, marketing strategist and part-time cmo at bbr companies, was recently inducted into the association for accounting marketing hall of fame. ruszczyk joined aam in 2007 and served on the board from 2016 to 2020. this recognition can be added to bonnie being named aam’s volunteer of the year in 2014, one of accounting today’s top 100 most influential people, and one of cpa practice advisor’s most powerful women in accounting. bonnie is also the president and manager of the accounting move project. 

 transcript
(transcripts are made available as soon as possible. they are not fully edited for grammar or spelling.)

jean: hello, this is jean caragher, president of capstone marketing. i am happy to be speaking today with bonnie buol ruszczyk, marketing strategist and part-time cmo at bbr companies, who was recently inducted into the association for accounting marketing hall of fame. bonnie joined aam in 2007 and served on the board from 2016 to 2020. this recognition can be added to bonnie being named aam’s volunteer of the year in 2014, one of accounting today’s top 100 influential people and one of cpa practice advisor’s most powerful women in accounting. congratulations, bonnie, on being inducted into the aam hall of fame. 

bonnie: thank you. it was a true honor and surprise, as anyone that was there realized very quickly when i got on stage. 

jean: yes, it was a surprise, but i still enjoy it when they don’t let everybody know in advance that they’re winning something. i think the reaction, it’s just so authentic, you know, and right there. and i do recall your need for an adult beverage after that announcement. 

bonnie: well, i was standing between everybody in that room and cocktail hour. so i was like, i’m going to make this quick because, you know, everybody’s going to want to go get their little cocktail on and enjoy the networking afterwards. so far be it for me to stand between somebody and a good drink. 

jean: well, it was very well deserved and you deserve that time and recognition. so i’m so happy with the way it worked out. 

bonnie: thank you. 

jean: so this is not our first capstone conversation. we had one of these back when you were named volunteer of the year, like i just mentioned. so for me, it’s going to be fun to see how your answers may be different or the same as it was 11 years ago. 

bonnie: i am curious to see the same thing. 

jean: so let’s start off with what you think is the greatest challenge in marketing cpa firms. 

bonnie: i would say, and i may have said this 11 years ago too, i think it’s differentiation and, you know, what a firm can bring to the table that others don’t. you know, often people are like, “we’re the best,” or, “we’re great,” or, “our people are great,” or things like that. and honestly, that is noise. it doesn’t mean anything to anybody. you know, you can think you’re the greatest out there. what people are really looking for is what can you do for me, you know, that’s going to make the firm stand out? and differentiation is the way to do that. 

jean: so do you think that differentiation is even more of a challenge these days given all of the tools we have, the data we can collect, firms embracing niching, you know, to a degree? is it harder now? 

bonnie: i don’t know if it’s harder, but i do think it’s even more important because of whether you call it the media environment or whatever we do, so much of the information we receive is curated for us. so we expect messages and, you know, the email newsletters and everything that we get to be specific to our needs. so, so do accounting firm clients. and that is where that differentiation comes into play. like, what’s in it for me? you know, and if you’re out there trying to be all things for all people, you’re being nothing for no one in reality is the way i kind of think about it. 

jean: right, right. because the differentiation, i think, encourages firm partners and marketers to figure out where is our sweet spot? you know, who are our ideal clients? how do we get more like them? what do they need from us? and what types of clients should we not be working with? so it’s it’s about differentiating and standing out. and it’s also about how it helps firms then make smart marketing and business development answers to just run their company in a smarter way. 

bonnie: yeah. and you hit on something that i think is really important is not only is it good to identify the types of clients that you want, that you can serve really well, but it is also sometimes even more important to identify those that you can’t, that they’re not a good fit for your firm because they’re dragging you down, they’re frustrating your people. and you’re not if you’re not able to serve them in the way that is going to be the best for them, then refer them to somebody else that can and focus on those where you’re really bringing the best value. and i think that’s where a lot of firms are understandably uncomfortable to say, you know what, 10% of our client base is just not a good fit for us, but we still get revenue from them. but, you know, in reality, when you really start thinking about it, you can carve that 10% off and dedicate that time to providing higher level services for clients that appreciate it and need it more. and so that loss that you got from that 10% is going to come back to you oftentimes three, four or five fold because you’re doing what you do well. 

jean: yeah. yeah. we could spend the next half an hour just talking about that one point. 

bonnie: yes. 

jean: because i’ve done a few workshops about firing clients and it’s amazing the reasons why they don’t fire clients. gosh, yeah, we could we could talk about that forever. so tell us, you know, obviously you’ve been in the profession a long time now, what do you see as the biggest opportunity for accounting marketers? 

bonnie: i feel like, and especially since you mentioned our conversation 11 years ago, i am very pleased to see that there has been a big shift in the level of respect that accounting marketers have, you know, since i’ve been in this space. and i still think it’s not as high as it probably should be. and that’s a firm-by-firm basis right there. but marketers bring skills to accounting firms that, you know, in many cases, no one else in the firm have, you know, they approach things from a different point of view. when i was working in a firm, i always talked about being the sole left brain in a sea of right brains. but it’s an incredibly important skill and it is something that should be seen as such and valued as such within firms. 

so i think while it’s much better than it used to be, when i joined an accounting firm as a marketer, i believe the average tenure was 13 months in that job. i outlasted that, but only about double. but i think it’s really important for marketers to be bold. and, you know, i did a presentation many, many years ago for aam on, you know, grab your seat at the table. and that’s whether you’re talking about growth, but also things like mergers and acquisitions or just, you know, what services or industries are we going to really focus on? you know, all of these kind of things, marketers can bring in a tremendous perspective to it and one that is different from the partner group or those that have been there a long time. so i think that’s been an opportunity for a long time, but i think it’s one that we need to continue to grab. 

jean: right. and i think you’ll agree with me, that is something that the marketers need to grab for themselves in the majority of cases, that if they’re waiting, you know, to be invited to the table, they might be waiting a really long time. but if they’re sharing ideas and vision and strategy and educating their partner group on the betterment of the firm and its growth, then they’re going to listen. but if they’re waiting, you know, for joe partner to make the invitation, i think in most cases they’d be waiting a really long time. 

bonnie: oh, i think so, too. and i think one of the ways that i’ve seen work really well for this is firms want to know what other firms are doing. there’s this like, “oh, what are they doing over at such and so that’s a competitor?” or things like that. and i’ve seen a lot of marketers make a lot of headway in this area by saying, “hey, at so-and-so firm that is growing like gangbusters, they have their marketing director, or cmo, or whatever the role is sit in their partner meetings.” maybe not all of them, but, you know, certainly the majority of them. so when you’re talking about high-level firm things, the marketer is there to be a part of those conversations. now, you also have to have a level of respect for that person in the room. you know, it’s not like just including them so they can hear what’s going on. no, you need to allow them to have a voice and listen to that voice. but i think a lot of times there’s this whole, you know, “oh, what are other people doing?” sometimes, you know, that works in helping you get that seat at the table. 

jean: right. and i think it’s exciting that we’re seeing colleagues become ceos and chief administrative officers or operating officers and principals and partners and ceos of state societies. and there’s so many just fantastic examples out there of people who’ve started as accounting marketers and have advanced in their careers to such a high level. 

bonnie: yeah. and i think, you know, i know part of…one of the people that we both know, of course, is eric majchrzak, and beachfleischman is doing a tremendous job out there on a variety of levels, you know, and i think part of that is eric comes to the table with kind of a different mindset than your typical partner who gets promoted to the role of managing partner. and i’m not saying that every firm should be run by a marketing person, but i do think, you know, that’s one of the things with the accounting move project, you know, we talk about diversity and how important that is. well, it’s diversity of thought, diversity of background, diversity of experience that just makes everybody’s…makes the firm stronger and makes everybody a little bit smarter, too. you know, so i think that’s extraordinarily important. 

jean: right. okay. so partners watching and listening, that’s one of the gems, you know, that bonnie is sharing with us today. you know, take a look at your marketers and…well, if you don’t have marketers, that’s a whole nother conversation, but take a look at your marketers and see how different they can contribute to overall management and strategy for the firm in addition to what they may already be doing. so i know you’ve got a big network. so when you think about, you know, folks in your network, what factors or skills did they have that have made them successful? 

bonnie: well, not to continue beating the same drum, but i think owning your space and having confidence to get that seat at the table. and, you know, if you don’t feel like you have the knowledge or the experience for that yet, then going out there and getting that knowledge, talk to people that you respect or that have had a career that you would like to emulate with yours. and i think too, there’s a lot of advantage and benefit from looking at other professions, too. everybody in accounting wants to think that accounting is just so unique. but in reality, we can learn a lot from not just other professional services, but other services in general out there. so reading a lot of things. 

but i do think one of the biggest things, and frankly, one of the biggest advantages i had was i would just reach out to people and be like, “all right, i see what you’re doing. i love what you’re doing. can you share with me how you came to those decisions? how did you position this with your partners to get their approval to move ahead in whatever way it is?” i think having that confidence and if you don’t have the confidence, go out there and get the knowledge so that you feel more confident when you’re trying to ask for what you need with your firm leaders. 

jean: right, right. because don’t you find most of the times when you do that and you reach out to other people that they’re pretty generous with their time and information sharing? 

bonnie: absolutely. i will tell you, sort of similar to this, when i started my firm, i started with nothing. i had no clients. i had nothing. and literally my husband and i sat down and i’m like, “i want to try this.” and we figured out that i can give this a shot for six months before we start worrying about the mortgage. so it was like, okay, let’s see what we can do here. and one of the biggest things that i contribute to still being here since ’09 is i reached out to so many people and it wasn’t for business as much as for advice and for input. and what wound up happening naturally though is people are like, “oh, you need to talk to this person,” or, “this person could use your skills.” and i’ll never forget, and i always give her credit for this. i met with a woman who somebody else introduced me to. we wound up having like a two-and-a-half hour coffee and over the weekend…this was our friday. 

over the weekend, she sent 15 individual emails saying, “bonnie, meet mark, mark, meet bonnie.” and three or four of those turned into my first clients, which set me off to, you know, be able to pay the mortgage, right? and it was such an incredible giving thing that she absolutely did not have to do, but she did. and i have always tried to pay that forward. but i also find that most people out there are so more than happy to help. they want others to succeed. and while it feels weird sometimes reaching out to people that maybe you don’t know, or you don’t know well, you know, i think a dose of honesty and just like, “hey, i respect what you’ve done and i would like to learn how you did it,” is huge. 

jean: right. yeah. and it’s nice to hear happy stories like that in this crazy world we live in, right? when people are being kind, right, and happy with each other. that’s awesome. so tell us, which of your personal skills do you believe has made you successful? 

bonnie: i have made a lot of mistakes in my life, personally and professionally. but a long time ago, i sat down with friend who was like, “all right, learn from it. you know, what did you do? what can you pull from this?” rather than kind of sitting there and wallowing or just beating yourself up, you know, what can i learn from this mistake that i made? and, you know, i realized that i do have knowledge that many others don’t. and i am more than happy to share that. and, you know, so i think it’s that willingness to kind of go out there, if you’re going to make a mistake, fine, it’s not the end of the world generally, and to learn from that. and i think, in general, that’s one of the things sometimes that we don’t necessarily want to admit, but i think that’s where we probably learn the most and are able to move forward the most. 

jean: yeah, that’s what i was gonna say. i think anybody who is at the point, you know, in their lives or careers and they’re not making any mistakes is that they’ve stopped learning. because i think making mistakes is is human, you know, we will never be able to do everything perfectly. and as you say, you know, taking what you can learn from that mistake is going to help the next time. 

bonnie: yeah, and not being overly embarrassed by it, you know, because yeah, we all make mistakes, you know, we trip on the sidewalk and we kind of laugh about it and move on. 

jean: yes. yeah, totally agree. and, you know, and i should tell you, your response about skills, you know, that marketers have to be successful. it was very close to what you were saying in 2014. because back then too, you talked about confidence and needing to know the business. and here, you just talked about, you know, gaining more knowledge and talking to people and reading. and let’s face it, nowadays there’s so much data that we can be online learning about all kinds of things. so the confidence really rang through. that’s a great point. 

bonnie: well, and i will say, and a goal that i set for myself every year, and i mean, you’re busy going to conferences, i’m busy going to conferences, and just all the things that we do, but i do always try to, whether it’s attend a conference or something that is purely for my knowledge, you know, it is not necessarily…i’m just there to learn. i’m not there to speak. i generally choose things that are outside of the accounting profession because i kind of want to learn from others. i do think sometimes we can get a little navel-gazey, you know, and i do think it’s valuable to kind of pull resources and information from others out there. and i think that’s kind of important too, you know, marketers especially spend so much time supporting others within the firm and teaching others and whether it’s, you know, a webinar on linkedin, or, you know, business development coaching, or whatever it is that you’re doing, that we kind of need to fill the well every once in a while. and i think that is something that is a worthwhile investment. i will say even if your firm isn’t going to pay for it, you know, to invest in yourself and your knowledge and your career. 

jean: yeah, absolutely. i’ll quick share a story. i’ve shared it before. but when you say, like, do it on your own dime. back in 1992, the second aam summit was in hilton head, and i was working at bdo at the time. and i was on the board and they would not pay for me to go to the conference. 

bonnie: shame on them. 

jean: yeah, right. so of course, i was annoyed. and fortunately, it was in hilton head. so that’s an easy drive from atlanta to hilton head. and then i asked the managing partner if the firm would be willing not to dock me vacation time to go there, but i would pay for the conference myself. and he actually looked at me, he said to me, “i thought that’s what you would say.” he didn’t say, “oh, we reconsidered,” you know, and all this stuff. so there you go. and obviously, i mean, that was important to me to be there. and i needed to stand up, and go, like, and make it happen. so hopefully, partners are much more open now to educating their marketers like they are with their professional staff and their accounts. i hope. so tell us about your top-priority initiative right now. 

bonnie: do you ever feel like you’re juggling, like, eight balls and you can probably use to toss off four? that feels like where i am right now. because in addition to, you know, bbr, which is the lion’s share of my work, i also own and manage the accounting move project. and we are, right now, in the midst of our busiest season. so encouraging firms to take the survey, and we’re focused on the idea of retention this year. and so the survey closes, i think it’s august 15th. so a lot of work going in there. and honestly, a lot of, you know, just working with firms. i tend to work with smaller firms where i am their marketing person and keeping them updated on everything that’s going on. and i mean, i still write blog posts on the, you know, recent budget bill that passed and things like that. so, yeah, i think the biggest priority for me is managing my day and making sure that i’m spending it in the way that brings the most value to my clients. 

jean: right. well said, busy, but i would say you’re working on things that you enjoy working on. 

bonnie: oh, absolutely. absolutely. i do feel very, very fortunate that i’ve created my own job, but i get to do things that i really enjoy doing. and i am very fortunate in that i really kind of get to choose, on some level, the clients that i take on and, you know, there’s those red flags. we all have clients that we know we shouldn’t be working with. and they’re not necessarily…they’re not the right one for me, but they may be the right one for somebody else. and i feel like i’ve gotten relatively good at noticing that really quickly. so i work with some just amazing people out there and love it. 

jean: that’s great. you know, covid gave us a lot of negative, but covid also gave us, you know, some positives. and one of the positives i took away is focusing on, you know, what do i really want to do and who do i want to work with? and when you have that time limit, i guess, would be the right word, you really want to be doing what you want to do and what makes you happy. you know, and do good for the world, you know, and contribute, and don’t spend your time with the people who are really frustrating you or have other negative impact. 

bonnie: completely agree. it’s amazing how age kind of gives you clarity. 

jean: oh, yeah. and each year gives us that much more clarity. okay, so i’ve got two more questions. what is your best piece of advice for accounting marketers? 

bonnie: i feel like i’m on a theme here today, but i’m like, be bold. you know what, understand your value and your worth. and while it’s hard, don’t be shy about sharing it when it’s appropriate. you know, understand that you are incredibly valuable to the firms that you work for. and in that vein, find your advocates within the firm. and honestly, i’ll tell you, this may not be a popular thing to say, but if you aren’t working at a firm that appreciates you, or is constantly putting you off, or shoving you aside, or that doesn’t see your value, then find a new place to work. life is short. and i know so many people out there that are just incredibly great and could bring tremendous value to firms, but they’re not in the right spot, or they’re not appreciated, or they, you know, come home and feel like they’re banging their head against a wall. and there are firms out there that would love to work with you. 

and another thing, you mentioned covid, you can generally work for a firm regardless of where you’re located or where the firm is located. so yeah, and if you gotta fly across country three or four times a year, okay, you know, that’s not a big deal. so i think that is kind of one of the most important things out there is know your value. and i’m not saying just quit your job over, you know, one bad day necessarily, but…back to the, you know, conversations with people, i have conversations with people a lot of times that are like, “i just can’t get anything done.” or, “i’m not given a budget. you know, every time i want to spend money, i have to go and ask somebody if i can spend money.” and i’m like, “well, you’re spending half your time there having conversations around a budget, just get a budget,” you know? 

jean: right. yeah, because i’m sure that lots of people have come to you, you know, for career advice like they’ve come to me for career advice. and sometimes that advice is, you know, move on, you know, find a different firm, or i hate to say, you know, profession or a different field. because you’re right, some of them are just not in the right place and they’re not given the respect to be a productive part of a firm’s team. 

bonnie: yeah. and it doesn’t necessarily mean that there’s anything wrong with you or wrong with the firm. it could just be a bad fit, you know. and it’s been a while since i’ve been dating, but, you know, that was one of the things you had to recognize, you know, it’s like, okay, this person is not right for me, so i’m better off going and, you know, being on my own for a minute or finding someone that is, you know? it’s not a failure in any way. 

jean: right. absolutely. okay, so my final question, i think maybe i know what you’re gonna say, but what’s your best piece of advice for managing partners? 

bonnie: yeah, you probably do know what i’m gonna say. i would say, listen to your marketers and give them the respect they deserve. and another thing, you know, we talked a little bit about niches earlier. don’t be afraid to focus on industries or services where you can truly shine. and i’ll use a client of mine for an example. i work with a client in dallas that serves only dental practices. they are niched beyond niched. you know, it’s not just even medical, it is dental practices. and they provide the highest level service and know that industry so incredibly well, that, you know, the value they’re bringing to their clients far exceeds the value that even really good firms can bring because, you know, they’re not necessarily as deep in that industry as this firm is. and honestly, as their outsourced marketing director, it makes my job so much easier because i’m not trying to reach everybody. i am only trying to reach dental practices within a certain, you know, revenue range. and it’s a whole lot easier to do that when you’re marketing to a smaller group. obviously you can be much more effective. so i would say kind of both of those things are my biggest advice to managing partners, whether it’s on this podcast or when i’m having conversations with them. i’m always saying this. 

jean: right, right. well, it’s good advice because niching, i believe, is the most effective strategy to grow a firm, you know, that there is. and you’re right, when you do have those specific niches, it helps everybody because, right, those are the conferences you go to, those are the shows you go on, where you write your articles, where you network, where your education is. i mean, you know, all of it. it just allows firms to be that much more focused and using a marketing professional to help them is going to make them that much more successful. it’s a great point. 

well, i’ve been speaking today with bonnie buol ruszczyk, marketing strategist and part-time cmo at bbr companies, who was recently inducted into the association for accounting marketing hall of fame. bonnie, congratulations again. well deserved. 

bonnie: thank you. thank you for having me. this has been great.